[SAS] PG/RVS

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Spidey01
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[SAS] PG/RVS

You need more skilled players active during the day.

SAS_Yogi
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Agreed. I play on the weekends mostly. I am usually busy with school on weekdays.

Ryan
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Or work together by making the public players (me included) play tactically? 'Skilled' is a sliding scale dependant on situation and experience. Skilled may not create a better experience, everyone working for one goal, together, might.

My idea of CQB is running in with a sword.

grumpoo
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i agree with you guys, we need to have somewhere to put the hours that we play. This would also help members to track prospective rcts and make sure everyone is committing their 5 hrs.

From the Muddled Mind of grumpoo.

SAS_Yogi
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Our policy is to play tactically every time we're in the server. If you want to play as part of our element, just ask to join. I'll always be up for leading the public players in RVS, whenever I'm in the server at least ^_^. I know I haven't played much over the past couple weeks, sorry Ryan.

SAS_Ezbass
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Welp, I am in there a bunch and quite a few of them that come in aint interested in doin some good team work, Most of the ones I see are the regulars that like to lone wolf it, But I am Always up for some TEAM play ! As a matter a fact it is better havin a team to play with!

SAS_Ezbass
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Dang, I forgot to say Howdy there Spidey!!!

Ryan
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Team it is, even if that's a 2-3 man team. Hahaha.

My idea of CQB is running in with a sword.

Lodige
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im fully agreed with ezzy !!
the most who join the rvs server are doesnt interested to play as team or set up a element they storm at spawn to the next door and try to kill much tangos as they can Sad
we can ask to join our element but we cant kick out everyone who wants to play lonewolf.and for sure alot ppl u dont wanna have in ur element because theyr having no idea of tactical gameplay or teamwork
thats the same guys who send in a application to join SAS and are wondering why they get no answer Acute
but u as publicplayer can show them how it works and earn the respect if u safe the hostage and kill 7 tangos but the mission is success as theyr killing 30 tangos but after 20 rounds u r stil on the same map Wink

SAS_Nick
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Hard to be present in the week days, because most of us are working. On my part, I'm online almost every night and on the weekends. SAS are always playing in team and sometimes we do quick plans on TS, but you are welcome to ask to be part of it. SAS are always up for some tactical playing.

SAS_Nick
22nd SAS Elite Virtual Regiment

method
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When i play on rvs server, I always try to play with SAS m8:s and do the teamwork (not when i'm the only one alive).

However, as EZ mentioned before that most of the regular players want to do it with "lone wolf-style". If we have 8 players on the server and 3-4 are making an element and 5-4 guys are doing it lone wolf, elements teamplay ability falls down since lone wolfers do everything alone, and messes up element plans Biggrin

IMO best way would be use to SWAT 4 server conduct on RvS where we pick a element leader, he tells plan, eq, formation etc. if we would like to increase teamplaying in RvS, but I guess these lone wolf regular players will change their regular server quite fast Biggrin .

IMAGE(http://miniprofile.xfire.com/bg/sf/type/0/eagle1709.png)

SAS_Ezbass
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That aint a bad idea there Method.

SAS_Yogi
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IMO best way would be use to SWAT 4 server conduct on RvS where we pick a element leader, he tells plan, eq, formation etc. if we would like to increase teamplaying in RvS, but I guess these lone wolf regular players will change their regular server quite fast Biggrin .

This is how I do it every time I get at least 4 people to play with. Just tell me you want to make and element and I'll gladly lead us Smile

grumpoo
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I have never understood the concept of 'the element.' does this refer to simply a group of guys wanting to play a game, the clan itself or simply a stepping stone for those who want to join?

From the Muddled Mind of grumpoo.

SAS_Yogi
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An element is the group of operators in the field. Commonly there are 5 people in an element: Pointman, Coverman, Element Leader, Backup, and Rear guard.

In SAS we designate people for each role and deploy on location, much as a dignified SWAT team would.

That is how we roll. Of course, in SWAT 4 this ends up happening for almost every game. But in Ravenshield it is a different story. There is no way to designate an official leader, so the practice of creating an element is not supported as much as it is in SWAT 4.

Sorry for the long post, but I wanted everyone to understand the long and short of it. The simplest answer to the previous predicament (not having organized teamplay) is that if you want to be a part of an element in game, all you have to do is ask a clan member.

Edit: And of course, you're always allowed to create and lead an element if there aren't any SAS members around! You just need a good group of team-oriented participants Smile

SAS_WIZ
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Yogi, i beg to disagree.......

Rvs was employed by SAS 22nd EVR well before SWAT4 was released and we simply moved our tactics over, at the time.

an element is a team of people within a group of people, heading for an objective in a bigger picture.

SAS MEMBERS---- Why has this stopped in RVS...Remember why you are here, but remember what got you here... Thankyou

SAS_WIZ

SAS_Sniper
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Hey Spidey how are you doing ?

I have to agree with LtCol here why has SAS members forgot that we have two official games?

I want to see the effort that is made in SWAT4 in RVS.

Public players if you see SAS members in the server, ask to be in their element. I remember when i was a public player in the server and i always always asking SAS members usually SAS Sgt Spidey, and SAS Capt WIZ.

We are the best for tactical play and we have proved that through the fact that we have been doing it in the same games for over 10 years. Be part of it .............get involved !

SAS_Capt_Sniper

Head of Recruitment & Tactical Training

GCHQ - 22nd SAS Elite Virtual Regiment

SAS_Random
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i've seen some good cooperation over the past few days. let's just keep it up. Yogi was doing a great job today as well sorting the server into two teams with different objectives and AOs, so we are heading in the right direction.

we just need to keep it going.

SAS_Vet_Random

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22nd [SAS] Elite Virtual Regiment

 

 

SAS_Yogi
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Yes, I do this as much as possible, like I said.

What do you disagree with, Wiz?
All I'm saying is that RvS supports Lone Wolves and Rambo better because there aren't official "Leaders" and "Red" and "Blue" teams like there are in SWAT.

I want to tell a story about something that happened today:

There were about 6 solid people in the server that were consistently playing with me as a team; accepting my orders, moving as an element, coordinating for the objective. Then, as they started to leave one by one, the team broke down. A couple of new people joined. For a couple of games we were 3 or 4 people (the only 4 on the server) just doing whatever we felt like. Then one person (name undisclosed) began to insult me and SAS itself because of our lame tactics. I immediately defended myself and the clan. It turned out that he was very upset because the three of us weren't playing as a team. All I could say was "You didn't ask to form a team". I proceeded to set up a briefing, equip the team, and dish out the formation. We had great cooperation and teamwork, which was required to get the map done (Presidio) with only 3 people. After a couple of tries we got it done, and we played, adding and subtracting people from the team, for a couple of hours. This is about where Random came in ^_^.

So the moral of the story, I think, is that we should not only encourage players to ask about joining our element, but we should actively ask everyone if they want to play as a team also. We had a terrible 30 minutes because no one was playing together and it ended up being partly my fault because I didn't ask them to play as a team.

So, gentlemen, like everyone has already said - remember what this clan is about! Take the initiative, and let's incorporate the pubbers in proving ground operations EVERY TIME.

If you read this entire post, thanks a lot Smile

Yours Indefinitely,
-Yogi

SAS_Nick
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Seriously, can we please stop bashing on RVS type of gameplay? Everytime I'm in the server, I see good coop games. Yogi is doing an awesome job on it. On my side, when I join, I set up plans. If anyone wants to play coop and make plans, SAS or not, you can do it.

SAS_Nick
22nd SAS Elite Virtual Regiment

grumpoo
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thanks for clearing that up, I'm a swat player so I always get confused when people talk about 'the element' as (as you know) we always play as an element in swat!
thank you kindly, hope for some great games in future...
grumpoo

From the Muddled Mind of grumpoo.

Spidey01
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To those that sent greetings, howdy right back at ya's :-).

From 7 years ago, the typical time in an [SAS] server looked like this:

  • [SAS] Members organised teams to accomplish the missions. Planning and leading the assault from IN GAME. Our superiors forced us not to use TS as a crutch for our C3 needs, and as a result many players came to [SAS] who would otherwise have never thought the clan tactical.

    [/*]

  • [SAS] Members controlled the crowd. No back talk, no cursing, no disrespect, no team killing, no rushing people to gogogo or f*** off. Members took care of it. Admins were ever present shock troopers or an AIM/XFire away.

    [/*]

  • [SAS] Lead the way. Faught harder, faster, longer, better than any pubber, recruited and retained only the best and kept sharpening to a razor fine edge.

    [/*]

  • If you joined the server for 8 hours straight, you would probably see 30+ maps roll by, and more than 20 of them likely planned and lead by [SAS] members in the server, in view of the public, and leaving people in awe of the SAS 22nd Elite Virtual Regiment and earning the respect of those they incorporated into the tactical operation.

    [/*]

  • When [SAS] walked into the server....the clouds parted, the tangoes weaped, server regulars rejoiced, and the trouble makers fled in fear or were removed by [SAS].
    [/*]

My fiancee and I have played pretty regularly lately. Steam shows me that over the past two weeks that I've put in around 40 hours and she has put in almost 50. My job keeps me out of game more than 50 hours a week.

This is what I have seen most of over the past two weeks:

  • Servers that proportionality are almost always 8/8 or 7/8 publics to [SAS] members.

    [/*]

  • Publics are ruling the server nearly unchecked.

    [/*]

  • Planning anything has been hopeless. No one will listen, no one will organize. Those publics that try don't know seem to understand: if the plan doesn't work, CHANGE IT. Or they refuse to change it because their plan must be right, just like they are 100% correct whenever [SAS] isn't in their face.

    [/*]

  • When [SAS] is present, they have tended to either ignore what is going on until bodies get team killed or "Join the party" and chat instead of doing crowd control. Wow.

    [/*]

  • More genitalia drawn on the map than I would expect to see on a brothels hidden CCTV cams.

    [/*]

  • Fragrant disrespect for other players and racism. Et cetera!

    [/*]

  • [SAS] Members that frequently, seem to lack experience in RvS and demonstrate little interest in managing the server. Like either they'd rather be safe and warm in SWAT land, or this is just a place to piss and party.

    [/*]

  • [SAS] Members confused about [SAS] perfected techniques for the map -> like the double bang entry on IE2/Mission.

    [/*]

  • Publics that play daily but don't even know how to do the maps.

    [/*]

  • Today I even saw a public player that performed more in the spirit of an [SAS] member than I've seen out of any uniformed member in the past 2 weeks...7 years ago I would have expected his skill out of every SAS_Trp and up as a prequsiite for passing a tryout. For the love of Stirling what was wrong with that picture?
    [/*]

So to those of you actually doing something....good job, go pat yourselves on the back. Either you're not around enough or your the only ones actually doing something. So respectfully, either stop playing like 4 hours a week or start policing this damn server already! 7 years ago it was rarely this bad and [SAS] had a lot less active members on The Mighty page, so what's the excuse?

Twice so far I've all but gone to NTF or openned my own server, just to have a _decent_ place to play the game. Sorry but I do not think I just picked a bad couple weeks to come visit!

SAS_Shawty
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I used to play 10 hours a week on the PG2 but now I have to prepare myself for school so I won't have much time left for the next 2 months. But whenever I have time I feel like the only SAS person each time on the servers... I remember we had atleast 5 SAS members not too long ago... what happend?!

.
Shawty

SAS_Random
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I've played rvs over the past two weeks. When I'm there, I've seen teamplay. I've seen Nick, EZ, Yogi, Malty and others all playing tactically when I'm there, just like they do when I'm not there.

WARNING: RANT BEGINS NOW....CLOSE THE EYES OF NTF MEMBER OR ANY OTHER SMALL CHILDREN IN THE ROOM....

Thank you for mentioning NTF. Since the split with NTF ( I think you left us around the same time, if memory serves me), our n4 admin is suddenly broken. Coincidence-- I don't think so. Your best buddies at NTF kinda showed their professionalism on the way out the door on that one.

Where are NTF players now? I really don't care, so no need to answer that rhetorical. They are certainly not playing RvS. Their pathetic server is empty 95% of the time. No one plays there unless they want to be alone with their thoughts or play lonewolf tactics. There is absolutely NO policing of that server you are holding up as a shining beacon of teampplay. Most of the other coop servers are empty as well. The only place to find sustained cooperative teamplay in RvS is our servers. Period. All the public players know that and come to US not the No one Thought First and Now Thoroughly Fubared clan.

We have tighter contol over SWAT because we can webadmin that game. In rvs, we can't, so we have to start our RvS game and join before we can do anything about poor play. Our server is mostly full, as you mention, so that makes the only way to get into it is to wait for a slot or restart the server. Effectively kicking everyone out so we can slip in while people figure out the server has "crashed."

Spidey, perhaps constructive action on your part would be to help WIZ perhaps fix n4 which would certainly make huge steps toward resolving the issue you are all of a sudden and suspiciously not willing to let go of...or you can play on NTF's empty server. The choice is yours. You made a choice before. Perhaps this time you wil get it right. Maybe there is hope for you yet.

You left SAS because you liked your NTF friends better. You defecated all over those who remained. By now puking all over the current SAS and talking about the good old days (when NTF members were still part of SAS) is not a solution. We can't always jump into a game to police RvS. 24/7 control over the RvS servers requires webadmin.

Anyone swayed by your "reasoning" above or who thinks otherwise is not thinking clearly. So, with all due respect to everyone on that happy train, keep your destructive comments to yourself unless you are willing to help be part of the solution.

Bitching and whining is the NTF way, not the SAS way.

END OF RANT....

PATIENTLY AWAITING CENSORSHIP OF ABOVE COMMENTS :x

SAS_Vet_Random

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22nd [SAS] Elite Virtual Regiment

 

 

SAS_Yogi
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Almost everything I've seen while I'm in the server contradicts what Spidey just said. Of course, I can probably believe some of it, because my 10 hours a week come from the weekend solely, and I don't really get to play often during the week.

The only thing I can really agree on is policing the server. Without admin rights, I really can't do anything to stop the people who don't respect the SAS tag, and I usually log on to xfire just to see other troopers and friends.

I'm not saying that there are never any admins on, I'm just saying that there always seems to be some problem when no admins are online. The problems always get dealt with quickly and smoothly if any admin is available.

The only real way to fix this is to either have admins on literally 24/7 (which I wouldn't ask for), or give troopers admin access in RvS (which seems plausible).

Until then I think we'll keep on seeing complaints like this from people who play on server full of Pubbers.

Indeep
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In my opinion,the map can be done with the T hunting,if the objectives are # 1 .
If im in" last guy" entering server , I take the RG or wait and watch the plan from there.

Optimistic with applied sense of humor...

Raptor
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I've seen Nick, EZ, Yogi, Malty and others all playing tactically when I'm there, just like they do when I'm not there.

Agree. They ensure really nice, tactical gameplay most of the time. Thx for this Biggrin

I can imagine that the lack of webadmin and reserved slots for admins is a huge problem. Mb it would help to give the Troopers admin permissions, so you get more admis (they have admin rights in swat, haven't they?). Also I like the idea to use the same pretty strict rules as in swat.

Anyway tactical gaming works best with an admin online. And SAS members online at the server are a warranty for great games Biggrin

Sincerely
AST|

SAS_Random
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The problem that plagues RvS is the inability to restrict what things admins can do to the server. In SWAT's Gezmod or other admin mods, you can give Troopers access to what they need to keep order, without giving them any real ability to cause damage to or overwrite the game files.

In RvS admins have all or nothing. So the Troopers have to live with nothing until the N4 is fixed...if that is even possible.

SAS_Vet_Random

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Spidey01
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The only thing I can really agree on is policing the server. Without admin rights, I really can't do anything to stop the people who don't respect the SAS tag, and I usually log on to xfire just to see other troopers and friends.

In my day there was a custom [SAS] mod for N4 that gave Trp's limited web admin access, that was lost when web master James was dishonorably discharged and files redone from upstream sources to ensure no backdoors were left behind. In the years that followed: fixing that would have been approximately five to ten lines of code being patched in but GCHQ's decision last time I had tried putting that up was no, the Cpls are doing a good enough job that they don't need it. I know this because I was there when it was said and I had taken the time to reverse engineer N4 and it's network protcol, with the hopes of making an admin client people could install.

If you have a problem with Trp's lacking admin in RvS, take it to your RSM or Webmaster and push it up the line. Airing your opinions of handicap here in public only make things look worse for [SAS].

I've played rvs over the past two weeks. When I'm there, I've seen teamplay. I've seen Nick, EZ, Yogi, Malty and others all playing tactically when I'm there, just like they do when I'm not there.

When I have seen Lodige, Nick, West, Malty, and JB over the last two weeks, all I have seen is run around the map. The only ones I've seen try anything serious have been Lodige, Malty, and Shawty. One of them was only there because I called for an admin, and only one of them frankly had enough experience.

Thank you for mentioning NTF. Since the split with NTF ( I think you left us around the same time, if memory serves me), our n4 admin is suddenly broken. Coincidence-- I don't think so. Your best buddies at NTF kinda showed their professionalism on the way out the door on that one.

If your memory doesn't work my reasons for leaving are actions and inactions by You and Wiz making me unable to perform my duties, and fully noted on my blog and countless lines of chatlog with WIZ and several useless messages to you. I am also on thick record that I will never serve under Rouge (NTF's CO).

You have also just implied the accusation that myself or Timbo or both of us being a traitor that crippled your server admin on our respective ways out. That's you being a real man to post that isn't it?

Next time you want to imply such dishonour in front of someone who dedicated 6 years of life to [SAS] and kept almost 24/7 ON CALL for the membership, fraught three freaking internal wars, got crapped on with being told to do 3 members worth of work load twice in a row (as Cpl; then as RSM) and went to the point of being the only person still believing in GCHQ for most of 2007, call me a traitor straight to my face Random or be more specific.

So I'm going to assume you're implying Timbo is a traitor, behind his back. Nice leadership skills you have.

I was the first person that I know of in [SAS] history to have that much admin access, and issue instructions to GCHQ on how to remove my access, verify the integrity of all the web files if y'all had allowed the proper infrastructure to be used for that, and even how to totally remove any chance of wrong doing from anyone by overwriting the files from upstream sources (WIZ knows what this means) -- so if I had done anything at all, it wouldn't be my fault no body didn't bother to follow the kind of real-world SOP organizations use for an exiting admin. And I know for a fact WIZ would do those and more to ensure the integrity of the website, because like me: he would choose better safe than trusting. He is the one that made the security and reliability of this web site impressive.

So I'm pretty sure it's not my responsibility your under-used toy broke Random ^_^.

No one plays there [NTF] unless they want to be alone with their thoughts or play lonewolf tactics. There is absolutely NO policing of that server you are holding up as a shining beacon of teampplay. Most of the other coop servers are empty as well. The only place to find sustained cooperative teamplay in RvS is our servers. Period. All the public players know that and come to US not the No one Thought First and Now Thoroughly Fubared clan.

Maybe that is why there is so much garbage going on your servers when no [SAS] are watching and groups of people like me that want a decent game, have to find an empty server to play in, or host our own for a few hours of un-spoiled play time. I've seen 3 people in NTF's server in 2 weeks (I watch both servers in the list) but at least an empty server is tolerable versus the rable.

We have tighter contol over SWAT because we can webadmin that game. ...

Spidey, perhaps constructive action on your part would be to help WIZ perhaps fix n4 which would certainly make huge steps toward resolving the issue you are all of a sudden and suspiciously not willing to let go of...or you can play on NTF's empty server.

The only sudden and suspiciousness involved is one day I had an urge to play RvS, and then my fiancee started to play it more regularlly -- and [SAS]'s server was where I always would suggest people go. Now I suggest people make their own listen servers for decent games.

I'm not [SAS], I am a masterless Ronin. So guess what Random? I'm not able to fix y'alls crap anymore. Unless you have more to childishly imply?

Even if GCHQ would pay my bill for services rendered to fix them (which would be requiring all Trp's and up to get at least adminsay/kick access through it as long as N4 is used, just like it was 7 years ago, and a perm-sticky in the mess to remind future officers of that deal), I rather doubt present GCHQ would agree to such a thing even if that price tag were cheap enough for them. Because I am not [SAS], and I'm not kind enough a person to re-join just for fixing N4.

You left SAS because you liked your NTF friends better. You defecated all over those who remained.

I left because my superiors defecated over me until I had no more ability left to serve than a Trooper does in the present day [SAS]. The amount of threats leveled at me didn't help either.

By now puking all over the current SAS and talking about the good old days (when NTF members were still part of SAS) is not a solution.

Holy moly, I didn't know you loved Rasa or Rouge that much to think that way Random. Everyone else in NTF that was once [SAS], didn't even know of [SAS] 7 years ago! ROFL!!!! Back then they were Trps.

Anyone swayed by your "reasoning" above or who thinks otherwise is not thinking clearly.

You're still always right and never living in denial I see, or maybe the crap that happens when "Reliable" [SAS] members are on the server doesn't exist because they are not there to see it? Good job old man.

So, with all due respect to everyone on that['s] happy train, keep your destructive comments to yourself unless you are willing to help be part of the solution.

I agree. 7 years ago some of the comments members have posted here, even Recruits would have not aired in public and if they had, would have seen PM's from an SNCO or Commissioned Officer. But it is not my problem to worry about what members post anymore.

Bitching and whining is the NTF way, not the SAS way.

Yeah, now if only the [SAS] way was still the way of elite professionalism it was when I joined.

Ryan
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Idea: Public Training Session.
Idea: Down-to-earth attitude.

The problem with working with public players and clanners is conflicting attitudes or personalities on both sides. The problem with untactical gameplay is as Spidey basically stated, to advertise as a tactical-only clan or server... the pubbers who don't like that will quit, as they have done before. Most of the guys I've played with are great, and play tactically - if they're not for you Spidey then oh well. When I see you on I'll link up with you and play tactically. Smile

My idea of CQB is running in with a sword.

SAS_Yogi
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Great attitude Ryan, thanks for posting ^_^

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